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  1. #1
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    Exclamation my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    Well here are some pictures of what i think is sclerosing lymphangitis. It is like a ridge under the head and can be felt as hardenened vessels, i have had it for months now and it has not gone away but that was without any type of treatment because i did not even realize it was even there till not too long ago. Now i am trying not to get erections or any sexual activity obviously and i'm taking aspirin.

    Here is what i've been doing so far first week:
    325mg aspirin before i start my heat pad, light light massage.

    I have tried the water dunks from hot to cold a lil and need to try it more.
    I have hirudoid cream coming on the way, in the mail.
    Currently i am also trying to get help from Sizequest and others who have said they have suffered from sclerosing lymphangitis and recovered.

    My questions is should i take more aspirin, i've been taking just one Bayer which is 325 mg right before my therapy. And Ibruprofen??


    I also wonder with this kind of injury, where does a clot go when it is resolved. Either it being a lymph clot(my case) or a vein clot, where does it go. I have heard of clots going to the heart and lungs and killing people? I would go to a urologist but the research i've done on this and other cases like it always comes up not much known about it.

    I'm only 19 and i'm going to see a significant other out of state in 2 months, need help.

    Pain: After heat and massage it seems i can feel a dull pain coming from the right side.

    So now to the point, here are the pictures and i hope they work.
    I have outlined the sclerosing lymphangitis in red. and the green outline is what i think to be a cist that i have had for a long long time, like noticed a year ago. the cist i can move around and stuff and has never grown or shrank so i guess that's what that is, but i don't know what happens to t-veins when they get so old, or why people have them removed, do they hurt?

    picture is semi semi erect to try and make it a lil more notice
    Attached Images Attached Images
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  2. #2
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    DLD or MODs plz delete one, i accidently posted twice, sorry.
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  3. #3
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    I had something similar after an infection a few years ago (not that you've got an infection - it was seriously swollen and itchy), once the infection had gone I was left with a hard "cord like" structure under the skin and when hard it was like a stick (and killed), which over a few months went down. But for the following couple of years it was still slightly there and got painfull and sore (and more pronounced) when I was aroused. The "hardend" duct was around the circumferance in the exact same place as yours is, but then it came to junction and ran lengthways along the top.

    I saw 2 urologists, one thought it was a lymph duct, the other said a lymph duct couldn't swell to that size and it must be a thrombosed vein. On the second ones advice I TOTALLY abstained from sex and masturbation (including any sort of fondling, cradling etc) for about a month or so, and it more or less went away. Now it's pretty much ok, it's still slightly visible (looks like yours now) and after a heavy session it gets a bit sore and irratated.

    As for where it drains to, if it's a lymph duct (implying it's clearing away some benign minor infection) then it's doing it's job and trapping "foriegn bodies" (bacteria etc) which slowly get transported to the lymph nodes in the groin where they are broken down by the lymph, if it's a thrombosed vein then it's a clot which will get broken down by the white cells in the blood (you really don't need to worry too much about the clot - even a simple cut anywhere on the body forms a clot, it's only an issue under certain unusual circumstances clots cause a problem).

    Given your's isn't painfull or too swollen you've probably just irratated the lymph duct or vein (maybe a minor clog), avoid touching it for a few days and it will probably settle down..

  4. #4
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    forgot to say,

    I think people only get thrombosed viens removed because of pain and swelling, my doctor suggested I waited 6 months and if it hadn't gone then he might remove it..

  5. #5
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    See, guess whos back, its me tee-birrrdy - Yeah , I'm still down with MOS and I'm still dirrrrty.

    Man , lemme tell yah - life is definetly full of crazy coincidences !
    I've been away for countless month - due to a serious leg injury,rehab and endless work and now that I return - I notice that you have 100% the same shit under your dickhead as I have developed a couple weeks ago under mine

    ain't that funny. The pictures are perfect, I think that mine is worse though , because I have that shit on my underside , directly behind the frenulum or more precisely in the frenulum - this obviously hurts alot at times when you wonna get nasty...

    Man, I'm with you on this one. till we both heal again...I'll write again once I have more time -and more info.

    Btw, there is one thing that comes to mind instantly , it pretty new , called "wobenzym" in germany - do some research on that , it thins the blood and has alot of effects on lymphs , damaged lympgh , inflammations and so on...
    probably a good candidate to add into the aspirin, hirudoid ,nosex, hot-cold, mix !

    ~peace out
    8 x 6 workin fine with V and without
    Started @ 6.3" x 5.2"

  6. #6
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    yeah i got the same thing on the top of my penis right behind the head. ive had for months now but it dont hurt at all. i did not know that this lumpy vein was the same thing u mention in ur thread. i still pe with this problem should i stop. for a few weeks or what. ive stop for 3 weeks about 2 months ago but its still there.
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  7. #7
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    anthesia is this the same issue u have with the disease
    one pictures shows two small ball like veins.(sclerosing lymphangitis)
    the other is a small swollen ball like on the left side of my shaft near the head. what do u think it is. can it be a t vein and the other can it be other problem u spoke about sclerosing lymphangitis. i had this over 8 m0nths now. wont go away if even had 2-3 weeks off a couple of times during the 8 months. im still pe though but less intense
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  8. #8
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    Flixman, your third picture looks dead on to mine.

    T-birdy, i would love to have an experienced vet like you on my thread, but sorry to hear you have the same problem.

    I am way too scared to do any Penis Enlargement, I thought i could flacid stretch but i swear that started to make it worse seeing how the grip is right under the head where the lumping is.

    Another thing, last night i did hot cold treatment with an ice cube massaging for like 20 sec then heat, and today i felt dull pain during the day and after i did it, so maybe that's too cold.

    To- T-birdy: this wobenzym is this something that would be able to buy just like off line without prescription, and what are side effects, i'm going to search on it like you said too.

    But for all of us thinking you have a related problem, i really do think that it is either lymph blocks, or t-vien that never heals because of the place it is in.

    And T-birdy, mine does wrap around underneath the glans, just hard to notice when it wraps around the left side, doesn't wrap around the right.

    When i came home from work today i could feel it bothering me a lil i thought and took 2 bayer 325mg aspirin and it felt fine, but could see it good.

    I have takin 3 weeks off from all sexual excitment before, and that was just to see how long i could go for no reason, that is when i came back into hard stretching and thats when i started feeling the pain and really noticed to myself, aww there is a problem.

    Flixman, does yours ever hurt? t-birdy said his hurt much like mine, with excitement. The thing is there is just not much known about lymphangitis, some say it hurt, some say it doesn't, some say it never heals, some say it can but after lots of nothing. It may be just a term where the unknown about the penis injury is grouped into, which blows, lol.

    For me personally, if i had time i wouldn't be so freaked out, but i got 2 months before significant other, and well if it's not healed and i get to fuckin for those 2 weeks, what the hell, i'm back to square one or further damage.

    Another thing i'd like to address, which i might make a new thread cause it could be answered easy probably, is just about how heat or cold treatments help t-viens or the like have their clots break up. I'm going to be doing more reading and searching tonight and this weekend going to join Thunders to see what i can learn from other's experiences with the like.
    Last edited by Anesthesia; 06-14-06 at 10:51 PM.
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  9. #9
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    Another thing which i already mentioned, is i'm 19, so erections, yea they happen.

    So my 3 weeks i had off for no reason, i had rock hard erections sometimes which could be the reason no real healing happened. So right now i'm trying my hardest to stop them, which i'm getting better at, i try to workout more. lol. But morning wood is hard to get rid of and i'm always afraid that is hendering my healing, i find that peeing right away if any urge helps.
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  10. #10
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    anethesia it does not hurt at all. i believe i started getting this since the begining but never knew what it was exactly. i did a lot time on the extender for the first 3-4 months. but did not like the feeling of the extender. im thinking i probably got it from that dont know for sure. ive been pe also can be that too.

    im also doing some research on this problem hopefully i can get some answer for us all. also is there any moderators that may be can help with some knowledge of this.

    hey anethesia the other photos do u think that can be t vein. its just a lump on the left side. it swells up a little and within a day or so it goes a way. ive notice when i pe a little intense it happen. ive ease off a little but its still comes back. ive also taking time off for the injurie but its still there.
    Last edited by flixman; 06-14-06 at 11:49 PM.
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  11. #11
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    heu anthesia i found some info on t veins and sclerosing lymphangitis) its and oil substance u use and it help with these problems let me more research and ill inform u or u can check out the link

    http://www.thundersplace.org/forum/s...617#post506617
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  12. #12
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    hey anethesia ive read on thunder that our problem can be a t vein but with few months of damage . this guy said he had t vein after a few months of pe
    his injury looks like mine mayve even yours
    check it out . also read up on the evo oil it so call works miracles when u use it for a few weeks. previous thread hasd link to it
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  13. #13
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    First off, flixman, your pic of the thing on the left i would say is just some fluid build up since it happens after exercise and gos away in a day, now if you feel a hardening of any kind of vessel in the place when it's gone, it could be a t-vien or lymph block.

    The picture you posted of somebody else's injury looks like an extreme case of a t-vein or lymphangitis. I don't know what the donut effect really is but that sure looks like that dude has a donut under his ridge. I think mine would look like that if it was more swollen.

    The oil sounds like you have to make it?
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  14. #14
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    Also note to any others using this thread for help in the future, i have been told by sizequest who suffered this and healed it in 12-14 weeks:

    cut aspirin down to 80 mg once a day
    Heat twice a day, light massage,
    Use hirudoid cream, helps slightly supposedly, i still have not got mine yet, i'm hoping it helps alot.
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  15. #15
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    thanks for the help did u check out the thunder forum link for the evo oil.
    the oil suppost to work wonders read up on it and see what u think. i when out and purchase the 4 different oils and i started applying it today see what happens in a few weeks. for now im going to stop pe for a few weeks to heal. hope the info helps also
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  16. #16
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    since this is like a log of sort:

    Today I had a quicky with myself, first time in a week and i had to do it because i was getting hard erections at night that wouldn't go away for a while, which can't be good for the injury.

    I also thought about Blue Balls, which happens because the vessels never get to relax like they would after an ejacualation. so i figure that maybe i'll do it once a week to relieve pressure, i'll just go ez and not stretch the time out to long. I felt a lil bit of tenderness while i was goin at it but just heated before and after and felt fine. I'm thinking some of the pain i was feeling during the day was just pain from not beating off in the first place.

    On second note, still waiting for my hirudoid cream and it's coming from over seas so who knows when it'll get here, probably not in time.
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  17. #17
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    I dont know if this will help at all, but I have had the same injury, right below the head in two small bumps. For me, it has never hurt at all.Mine has not gone away, but I havent tried anything to get rid of it other than just by stopping everything that has to do with my penis other than pissing. I dont believe this will go away on its own, even if you stop Penis Enlargement and even by stopping masturbating.

    My lymph actually started new linkages im assuming to re-direct the fluid somewhere (I cant see where they go after a cm or less) in my penis. Its actually very interesting, but it also pisses me off at the same time.

    Im not sure since it started new routes to wherever in my penis, that means im ok or what...I really want to go see a doctor about this shit but its hard as hell to see the two bumps unless I am hard...and I dont want to masturbate infront of the doctor...

  18. #18
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    Excellent point, it is hard to see the bumps unless erect, and to feel them when soft you really have to massage deep kinda.

    In one spot for mine on the right, it gets a lil more swollen sometimes but i can massage it which might mean that it's not a full clot of the lymph or it's got somewhere else to go, but hard to do.
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

  19. #19
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    i got the two bumps under my head but im trying the evo oil and its helping decrease the bums a little its to soon to tell whats the outcome will be, but hopefully it helps.
    Sizegenetics and liquid cialis and PE Exercise

    these measurements are nbpl
    8-18-05
    FG=11cm (4.4 in)
    FL=9 cm (3.6 in)
    EG=12.5 cm (5.0 in)
    EL=15 cm (6.0 in)

    06-1-06
    FG= 13.5 cm (5.3 in)
    FL= 12.5 cm (4.9 in)
    EG= 15.5 cm (5.62 in)
    EL= 18.5 cm (7.2 in)

    Goal: As long as it takes
    EG= 16.25 cm (6.5 in)
    EL= 21.25 cm (8.0 in)

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Age
    30
    Posts
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    Re: my sclerosing lymphangitis, info for others, help for me.

    couple new notes.

    Had an hour long masterbation yesterday and it felt fine, but today the random lil pains i have felt before i felt at work for about 15 min, like i said randomly. Sometimes it makes me think the pains are a good sign or something, who knows, like clots moving or something, i wish, lol.

    another note, i have noticed sometime when using heat, fluid builds up in the soft parts of the injury/lymp, watever right above the beeded part of the vessel. I don't know if this is because the heat makes the lymph more managable and maybe can squeeze into smaller openings now bigger from the heat, but i usually massage it back down.

    Flixman, i think if the evo oil works super well for you i'll have to try it,
    (for nbpel stats subtract 0.5 from bpel)
    (started Nov 16, 2004) 6.25 bpel / 5 eg
    (Dec 16, 2004) 6.5 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (Jan 16, 2005) 6.625 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (Feb 16, 2005) 6.875 bpel / 5.5 eg
    (March 16, 2005) 6.9375 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (STOP April 17, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (Restart July 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.625 eg
    (August 13, 2005) 7 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (September 13, 2005) 7.1 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (October 14, 2005) 7.1/8 bpel / 5.75 eg
    (June 2006) yes have not PE since oct still 7. 1/8 bpel / lost some girth but wont drop below 5.625 eg

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